Can you spell Immunocytochemistry?
Maria Losito
Welcome to Interview with a Biologist.
I'm your host, Maria Losito and we're going to be joined today by a number of special guests. The students in the spring 2026 cell biology class completed independent experiments that they created after looking at changes to human cell cytoskeleton after exposure to various treatments, such as microplastics or caffeine. Today, we'll be hearing from different students to learn about their results.
First off I'm joined by Evan Schultz, a TA in the lab, who will be telling us a little bit about the cell biology course and the basic principles behind this experiment. Evan, as a graduate student at KU, What do you enjoy most about teaching undergraduate classes?
Evan Shultz
I really enjoy seeing students grow and learn and also get excited about the material or whatever it is that we're doing, especially this class. Really a bit of is an epitome of that. Students grow so much from the beginning to the end because they're really doing what they're learning is really hands on. So instead of just shoving a bunch of information in and then regurgitating it, they're actually learning and growing as scientists, which is so much fun. That is really fun for me. Yeah, yeah.
Maria Losito
I mean, I have a very, very limited amount of student interaction, especially with classwork. But I do a student in the lab research interview. And it is so satisfying to sort of hear about the growth from where they started to where they end up when I'm talking with them. So as a TA having more hands on. I bet that just feels so good.
Evan Shultz
Then it's so much fun because students kind of they figure out kind of what excites them about biology while they're in the class. And that's so fascinating for me, is to also learn about what they're interested in and see that kind of develop.
Maria Losito
You reached out to me about this whole thing and getting it put together. What sort of made you decide to think this will be a great thing for the podcast?
Evan Shultz
Well, there's kind of two reasons. The first one is that more than any other course I've TA’d for here at KU I really want to share about this course, because I wish I could have taken this course as an undergrad. This course, Dr. Jennifer Hueston, our lab director, has really built a course that has a lot of real value, not just for future scientists, but future doctors and future medical professionals.
You really get hands on training in being a biologist and developing real scientific thinking and conducting actual biomedical experiments. You're not just learning off of a textbook. You're actually doing these things, which is, as somebody who has transitioned in the past from being undergrad to trying to work in real life labs, that's a huge deal. That is a huge challenge.
And getting ahead of that is something I wish that I had. And yeah, these skills are the actual skills. that get you job as a scientist or as a biomedical professional and more and more, whether it's grad schools, medical schools, they're all looking for applicants who understand these skills, can actually perform these skills and think critically and scientifically.
And there's no way that you can learn any of this from just a textbook or online or asking AI. This is something you have to actually physically do. And I think that you guys are exceptionally well qualified coming out of this course for doing a lot of these techniques. I was blown away by how much you guys have grown and what you guys have done.
And that's sort of like the second reason is that I'm actually just really, really excited to share about this because I'm really excited and really proud of your guys's work and your experiments. You guys designed truly original and fascinating questions and figure out how to test them. And you got really beautiful data from the experiments you guys ran. So that was just a joy.
Maria Losito
I started at KU coming up on five years. So officially four years ago and seeing how the class based research has just developed since I first started, when we had maybe half of a CURE class to where it's at now has been really inspiring to know that, there are other opportunities for students to get these kind of hands on skills and learning, even outside of admittedly, a limited number of research spots that are available, so it's exciting to, kind of have all these students and to talk to us and learn more about how this has impacted them.
Evan Shultz
And I actually know that from the respect of a lot of people looking for undergrad help, they're looking for whether or not they've done courses like this, because they'll have already done and learned basically, the key critical components of how to work and function in a lab. And yeah, it's a huge boost to anybody's resume or application.
Maria Losito
Could you tell us about the experiments and techniques that this lab covers and offer to the students?
Evan Shultz
Yeah. So there are four key ones that they that they learn. The first, and honestly, one of the trickiest, but also one of the most meaningful is cell culture. So they spend the whole semester culturing cancer cells. And this is a technique that is foundational to all biomedical research. We've all heard of the huge impact that just the single HeLa cell line has had on medical history.
And so yeah, all research going forward uses models like this. And cell culture is a critical technique. They also learn Western blotting. They learn iimmunocytochemistry and they learn fluorescent microscopy. I for me personally, as a cell biologist, I consider these techniques to be the core techniques for any researcher, whether they're a doctor or a PhD. They are using these core techniques to investigate their questions in the field of biomedical science.
Maria Losito
So would you say that students in any sort of field of biology research or STEM research in general could benefit from this class?
Evan Shultz
Absolutely. I think not just people focused on purely on STEM but also medicine. I think that for people in medicine, understanding these techniques is, as I said before, really critical, because even now a lot of our medicine is based off of these techniques. Every single chemotherapy drug has had research done on it using these techniques. And every single, most, every single drug has also had that same rigorous process going through the pipeline of development.
So understanding how these experiments work, how this data, what this data looks like and how it's interpreted is critical for doctors when they're learning about new innovations in the field of medicine and reviewing old ones. For anybody in the STEM field, this class, more than any other, really teaches you critical scientific thinking that's broadly generalizable. So these students came up with their own questions from their own curiosity, and they went through a really rigorous process of figuring out how do we actually test this in a scientific way and ensure that we get usable results?
They that's huge. And I think it's something that anybody in any STEM field really needs to master in order to be successful scientist. The part of the lab that I enjoy most is definitely. their independent projects. I think it is just so much fun to see them be creative. And I really believe that this is like an amazing form of creativity is coming up with these questions, asking these questions, and then testing them in a scientific way. And yeah, there's just not just seeing them grow as scientists, but also just their actual results that they got were fascinating.
There was a group that did an experiment with microplastics and not just seeing what they did to the cells, but also so they boiled a tea bag, and then they extracted the microplastics that came out of that teabag, and it was actually visible to the human eye.
Maria Losito
Okay, so loose leaf is the way to go.
Evan Shultz
Yes.
Maria Losito
Get yourself an aluminum strainer, friends.
Evan Shultz
Yeah, whatever that little doohickey is called, I still need to get one. I remember after I saw those results, I tried to make a cup of tea by just cutting the teabag and pouring it into the thing, and it was a mess. But yeah, it was blew me away that you could actually, like, visibly see the microplastic pellet in from that extract from a single tea bag.
Maria Losito
I'm deeply upset and I'm going to be thinking about this. So fascinating. And then is there anything we haven't talked about that you think we should?
Evan Shultz
That's a good question I think. I really encourage anybody who's interested in taking this course to reach out to Doctor Jennifer Hueston.
It is a really fun course. You I would say that you don't have to worry so much about memorization. You really develop and grow as a critical thinker. And every, every lab that you do, I personally think is really fun and also really valuable. So if you're looking for a course that really is going to improve your resume and yourself as a scientist, this is this is the one that I would have taken.
Maria Losito
I'm joined today by Ariana Siddique. Ariana, would you tell us a little bit about yourself?
00;09;45;02 - 00;09;51;29
Ariana Siddique
Hi. My name is Ariana, and I'm a senior studying molecular, cellular and developmental biology with a minor in Spanish.
Maria Losito
what is sort of your end goal for once you graduate?
Ariana Siddique
I start my master's in public health program this summer, and then I'll do that for a year and hopefully go to medical school after.
Maria Losito
Is there like a particular kind of doctor you're looking into being?
Ariana Siddique
I think I'd be happy to do. Like any field of medicine, I kind of love all of it.
Maria Losito
Yeah. I mean, I guess that's kind of what rotation is for, is to get a feel for like, this is what I actually want to do, not just what I think. So very cool. Well, I'm excited to hear about where you are like five years down the line.
So for this class specifically, would you tell us a little bit about your research project and why you picked that treatment?
Ariana Siddique
So my partner Chelsea and I researched how different types of water would affect the actin cytoskeleton of HeLa cells, which are cervical cancer cells for Henrietta Lacks. And I kind of got the idea because I have fish tanks and in those tanks you have to control the nitrate levels, Ph Levels, temperature and all sorts of other chemicals and so since we use water as a dilution for most of the solutions in our lab, I was curious how that would have a maybe confounding effect on our experiments.
And so we tested three different types of water, all at the same temperature, and observed how they affected the structural integrity of the cells.
Maria Losito
Could you give us an idea of what those three different kinds were?
Ariana Siddique
So we did kind of a gradient of Hypotonicity. So we did molecular biology grade water which is purchased from like a science factory or something like that. It just appears in our lab and it's like the most pure form that I could find. We use DI water deionized water from a reverse osmosis filter that goes right into our lab in Haworth, and we use tap water from Haworth.
And I took a picture of the lime scale that was kind of built up on the faucet, and we did some research and saw that it might be because of iron or different types of dissolved minerals. So we're kind of curious how that would cause an effect on the cells.
van Shultz
And just butt in here it looked like a cave formation, like the actual faucet. Like a stalactite or mite.
Ariana Siddique
Yeah.
Evan Shultz
Whichever one. Yeah. It was kind of interesting to think about like, yeah, yeah.
Maria Losito
Yeah, it was nasty. I mean, I think about like all of the cheap apartments I've lived in over the course of my life and like just the mineral buildup that you'll get on showerheads. And after Haworth being built in the 60s, slash 80s, depending on the side you're in, I imagine that's a lot of built up, so I wouldn't be surprised you got some, like, grit. And part of me is a little terrified to know what the tap water did to these cells
So what were your findings?
Ariana Siddique
So it was pretty cool because all of the different water had a really distinct effect. Like you could tell which one was which. And we did a control using PBS. I forgot what it stands for, but it's isotonic so it doesn't it should be like neutral to the cells, which kind of give us an idea of a normal cell would look like and kind of went off of like past labs to remember what those cells looked like.
And overall, most of the cells were damaged and kind of mangled, like the Filopodia that are kind of sticking out from the cells had collapsed, and there were signs that it had lost adherence to the slide, which is kind of what HeLa cells are known for, being adherent. And I think the tap water was pretty menacing, like it was really kind of almost like hazy and collapsing, I guess is the word for.
Evan Shultz
It as compared to your control. PBS Control. They the PBS ones looked so healthy and really branched out, being like very healthy cancer cells. And then in your water, like all of them, all of them were just very disrupted. Their acting structure was very collapsed. The cells were in the process of dying. Yeah, yeah.
Ariana Siddique
And we looked around the slide because there's quite a few cells on the slide. It was pretty representative what we were seeing and the DI water we anticipated to probably be the least damaging. But and it was but it was still pretty severe. We were pretty surprised because DI water is what we used to make our buffers. And so if the water was causing so much damage, we were kind of curious, like, will we do different experiments to further their the skeletal integrity? Like how much of that is maybe because of just the water we were using.
Evan Shultz
And your exposure time wasn't very long, right?
Ariana Siddique
No, we just did three minutes because we were worried that it would just shock the cells, because any type of water that's not like buffered is going to destroy them, I think. And we were also really concerned about temperature, because those cells are so sensitive to different types of shocks. And another crazy thing was that the molecular biology grade water like since there's it's so pure, there's nothing to buffer anything like those cells were by far the worst.
So much was collapsed. You couldn't see any Filopodia and parts of the cell were kind of missing, kind of suggesting maybe it folded in on itself or just kind of maybe disintegrated, if that's possible.
Evan Shultz
Yeah. And so it was. So a lot of people think that, like, pure water is probably good to drink, but your results really showed that, like in reality, the water that our bodies need needs to have all these other ions in it, it needs to be balanced. The Ph needs to be right, otherwise it like pure water, don't want to just drink pure water from a laboratory because it actually will cause a lot of probably issues with whatever tissue comes in contact with.
Right. But yeah, your results were beautiful, beautiful staining. And one thing I didn't realize is just how. Yeah. So you're going into a master's in public health, right? Your project has is a really interesting kind of public health perspective, because we tested water that comes out of our faucets in Haworth, which is really interesting. And we all know Haworth is a very interesting ecosystem.
So, yeah, I thought that was really cool and had real world relevance.
Maria Losito
Thank you. Yeah. No, that honestly fascinating project. And like, I never really thought about the effect of water on cancer cells. They just in my brain as a non-science person. Like they exist within your body and they're doing bad things. And, you know, something, something just so ordinary as water can happen to, like, have an effect on that is kind of astounding.
And I guess this may be so far beyond what you know about. But like generally when you have cancer, you want to kill those cells. So by seeing cell death within your line, like, I don't know, did that have any sort of correlation or relevance or like make you think of anything as you were sort of unveiling these results?
Ariana Siddique
I mean, I guess my thinking was that if it's so harmful, harmful to the cancer cells, which I think are in my mind like more resilient than other cells that help, like the line of thinking for the research project was like, if they're this bad for the HeLa cells that are so strong, what would they do to like a normal, healthy cell that maybe isn't as resilient?
And so I guess, like my mind goes to drug delivery? Maybe. But if it's so harmful again, like it would probably also be just as bad to the other adjacent cells that are healthy.
Evan Shultz
And definitely these cells can be used as sort of like a model to get an understanding of the cellular level, how different treatments might affect not just cancer cells, but cells in other places in the body. And one thing I think is really interesting is that it reminds like in the course, you guys also did work with chemotherapy drugs on the same HeLa cells.
That not only reflects what it does to cancer cells, but really importantly also reflects the side effects that come from those chemotherapy agents that have really nasty side effects throughout the body. Because those drugs, especially because they're not super targeted, they're going to be affecting all the other cells in the body as well. And so both your water experiment and the other experiments you guys did in the course kind of reflect that.
The model that we use in these cancer cells are applicable both to cancer and normal body cells. Yeah.
Ariana Siddique
Right. And I think just to put into perspective, like we did a three minute incubation with the different waters, but everything else that we did to do the actual permutation and staining to stain the actin cytoskeleton was also like in the range of like 2 or 3 minute incubation. And so time was like very important to us. But we had an evacuation and so.
Maria Losito
Was it that fire drill day. Yes. I, you know, probably not a drill. There was something as always, but.
Ariana Siddique
Well, we were in our like para-formaldehyde fixation part of it after we had already learned water incubation. So we don't think it had any effects on the experiment. But it was a little terrifying because time was like like they're just so fragile in that sense.
Evan Shultz
Yeah, you guys got lucky. Unlucky, but also lucky because you guys did fix before something happened. And then we all had to leave. That was that was literally happened just at the right, like the worst possible time, because a lot of people were just in the middle of their experiments. So that was that was pretty crazy. But I think everybody actually managed to salvage what they were working on.
Evan Shultz
And people got really cool results.
Maria Losito
Yeah, I mean, I'm glad it was salvageable and you didn't have to run the experiment again.
What did you enjoy about doing this experiment?
Ariana Siddique
I think my favorite part was getting to do the stain and kind of wait in anticipation of what we would see. I think we were expecting some dramatic results, but could not have anticipated, like just how dramatic they were. And I think just seeing, like, something that's so deceptively simple, like water from a faucet having such a detrimental effect was like an exciting prospect.
Maria Losito
So for this class overall, how do you think all of these experiments that you did is going to benefit you in the future?
Ariana Siddique
I think it gave me a lot of critical thinking skills and problem solving, more so than like I would in the classroom. I think just because, like, you run into problems that you would never think about. Like one thing we talked about when we were coming up with the project was visualizing the project, and then how when we visualized that, we saw like what made sense on paper didn't really make sense in practice.
When we were actually doing the experiment, we ran into all sorts of issues, like for everything from an evacuation to I think we forgot to cover the your light sensitive stain with a bucket to prevent light from seeping in. And, you know, that could have been detrimental to. But I think just learning how to bounce back.
And I think salvage is a good word. Like I think in real life a lot of things don't go as planned. And you have to like think back and salvage it. And I think that class helped me like in a really practical sense.
Evan Shultz
Yeah. In terms of like any kind of research, troubleshooting is something that happens at every stage. You guys really did a great job troubleshooting your project in real time. And like if it can go wrong, it will go wrong. And that was so clear with your entire class because the fire alarm went off and that just you guys had to troubleshoot.
how could this have affected our experiment? And you had to use your understanding of the techniques which you guys demonstrated very well about how this might actually, you know, is this going to negatively affect the results? Is this going to make it so that the results are usable? Are they not usable? Does it provide or cause any limitations to what we see afterward? And you guys did a great job.
Ariana Siddique
And one thing Evan said, like throughout the class was to think, like, curiously and critically about everything, like in every day. And I feel like our class had a lot of projects that kind of demonstrate that. So we did, I think two different groups did sunscreen and how that affects the cells and things like that. So I think that's something I'll take into the future, is to just think like a little deeper and ask why things are the way they are.
Maria Losito
Yeah, I mean, honestly, a great skill set to, to, to take from, you know, what you just said. And then also when you, you had mentioned like the problem solving around problems arising like between work and just real life, that is something so good to sort of instill now and just always be kind of mindful in thinking.
Evan Shultz
And I just want to give a shout out to Dan, who runs the greenhouses in Haworth. We used his sunlight for the sunscreen experiments and everybody in your guys's class came up with really, truly original creative questions and experiments to run. And it was really, really fun to see you guys do that.
Maria Losito
Yeah. And I guess if you happen to know sunscreen in the greenhouse. Yes. No. Is it is it even more necessary than outside of it?
Evan Shultz
So they actually exposed their cells sort of like outside the greenhouses, but on that.
Maria Losito
Sort of the patio veranda.
Evan Shultz
Yeah. And so the interesting part though was they the cells were in polystyrene plastic. So the UV that was getting through was mostly UVA, which is something. So essentially the results, they actually did see that you if you don't use sunscreen you do get damage to the cells even just through UVA coming through plastic which is relevant for, you know, us terms of glass window panes or, you know, other ways that sun can get into interior environments, which is kind of freaky to think about.
And yeah, but their results are also really, really cool. They tested mineral versus chemical and it was a very interesting experiment.
Maria Losito
It sounds like it! and sorry for getting off subject, but like as someone who's like, I got to sunscreen, I had to know,
Evan Shultz
And unfortunately they said that mineral was better, which is unfortunate because that's the one that is so annoying to put on.
Maria Losito
It's true. And then like, I always have problems with, like after I've been wearing it for a while, it starts to like, gum up a bit. Thank you, pill.
Evan Shultz
Yeah.
Maria Losito
Yeah, yeah. And I'm just like. But I want to look smooth, so. Yeah. Good to know. Okay. And then final question. What part of the lab did you enjoy most?
Ariana Siddique
I think my favorite part, I was really excited when I saw we're learning about HeLa cells because I read the book about Henrietta Lacks, and she was always something that I was like, oh, this is terrible what happened to her. But such an interesting story. And I was really excited because one of the first things I did in class was we learned about the cells, but we also talked about like the public health perspective of it too, which was like very exciting for me.
And it was really cool because it kind of showed me that, like, there was a place for both, like public health research and medicine that kind of coexist, and it was just exciting to see that in practice, because I feel like when you're in college, you're like, oh, I would love to be in the intersection of all of this, but then you get to actually do it. And that was really cool.
Maria Losito
Yeah, I mean, it's great in a way to have that hands on sort of experience prior to entering the workforce and being able to sort of start digesting it now. And I believe that book you mentioned is The Immortal Life of Henrietta Lacks. If my if my title memory is right. Awesome. Well, thank you so much. Is there anything else that you want to tell us about before we sort of sign off?
Evan Shultz
I just wanted to share that as somebody, I wish that I had the skills that you have now coming out of this course when I was undergrad, because when I graduated, I didn't have the opportunity to really learn these techniques as well as you have your iImmunocytochemistry, your staining skills, your microscopy skills, far and above what I was able to do at your stage and what I think most people are able to do.
It was really beautiful work and that was really fun to see. It was so much fun to see you guys grow throughout the semester and try new things and fail, but also really succeed. And that was really awesome. Yeah.
Ariana Siddique
Thank you for all your help this semester. You're the best GTA.
Maria Losito
Awesome. Ariana, thank you so much. I really appreciate you coming and talking to us today.
Ariana Siddique
Thank you. It was nice meeting you.
Maria Losito
I'm joined by Gus Peters. Gus, would you mind telling us a little bit about yourself?
Gus Peters
Yeah, my name is Gus Peters. I'm a junior MCB major.
Maria Losito
What do you plan to do after you graduate?
Gus Peters
Yeah. After I graduate, hopefully I'll go into med school. I'm taking the MCAT this summer, so good luck. Cross for that. Yeah.
Maria Losito
Cool. And then is there a specific kind of doctor you want to be?
Gus Peters
I want to go into anesthesiology. Hopefully.
Maria Losito
So would you tell us about your research project and why you picked that treatment?
Gus Peters
Yeah. So me and my lab partner, we wanted to look at how phone lighting can impact cell health. Specifically, we wanted to look at actin filaments in the cytoskeleton. So we really wanted to look at it just because we're students were on our phones a lot. A lot of other students are also on technology of ton of other forms, and we just wanted to see how that impacts our health and if we could maybe cause better health outcomes.
Maria Losito
Yeah. So this would be specifically for blue light, correct?
Gus Peters
Yeah. So we wanted to look at blue lighting in phones, but we also wanted to look at warm lighting. So we tested with both like a normal phone and then also a phone that we turned night mode on to see if there would be any differences there.
Maria Losito
So with the two different light settings, what did you find?
Gus Peters
Yeah. So it was it was really weird. We looked at the two different light settings and we expected a lot of damage in these blue light exposed cells because you know blue light carries more energy. We thought maybe it would Depolymerize there. And what we actually found was that the warm light exposed phones had more damage, like they showed odd nucleus shapes.
They had very Depolymerize actin. And the normally phone exposed cells actually showed closer to our controls. They were relatively stable.
Maria Losito
That's fascinating. So just kind of for a mental picture, were you just like holding your phone up to the cells?
Gus Peters
Yeah. So we took our phones. It was my phone and then my lab partner's phone. And what we did is we put them on max brightness. We just put a white screen on there. We made sure all the notifications were turned off so we wouldn't get any interruptions while we were testing. And then we just put that on top of the cell plates and then covered all the cell plates with a box.
So it was only the phone lighting and just left them like that for 30 minutes.
Maria Losito
How did you decide 30 minutes?
Gus Peters
We thought that would be good enough to just give a result.
Maria Losito
What more can you tell us about your findings?
Gus Peters
So our findings once again they were like very odd. Not what we expected. So when we expose the cells to what I'm just going to call a normal phone, regular phone lighting. We saw that actin Depolymerize a little bit. The nucleus was slightly bean shaped, which shows that maybe it wasn't completing mitosis correctly, but for the most part the changes were very minimal.
And then when we looked at the cells exposed to warm light, there were very odd things happening. So there were a lot of little lobes coming off of the nucleus, which maybe shows damage there. Many of the nuclei were that bean shape. They weren't dividing properly. We saw quite a few less cells. And then that actin was just kind of wholly demolished.
It was very clustered around the nucleus, but every other filament just kind of wasn't there.
Evan Schultz
This is not good news for the blue light glasses, people.
Maria Losito
So? So they don't work is what I'm learning, right?
Gus Peters
Yeah. We were hoping to test blue light glasses, but we didn't get the opportunity to do that, so maybe they're different.
This is this is not what I would have expected either because of the reasons you said, but I think that you guys did a really good job designing your controls. So you had like all the light because of the warm light mode? Well that does. Right? Correct. If I'm wrong, it kind of screens out that blue light coming through.
Yeah. We couldn't find like exactly what it does, but it makes like the screen more yellow. We're kind of assuming the wavelength shifted towards that red end. They don't they keep their trade secrets close. We can figure out what they really meant by all of it.
Maria Losito
I'm kind of wondering because I think about like in the beauty world they're like red light masks.
And they're talked up as things that are like anti-aging. But it sounds like red light is more destructive than the blue. If I if I'm recalling correctly, or at least from what you kind of seen.
Gus Peters
yeah, I would. Yeah, It would be worth testing that I know UV damage can cause a lot of issues with the skin. I don't know what a red light mask would really do for you.
Evan Schultz
Yeah. This year we actually had some students test a red light therapy device on their cells, and they saw that the red light treated group, actually their actin filaments were less depolymerized and like stronger and healthier than their group that was treated with just normal ambient white light. I'm not sure what that means in terms of like whether that's a good thing or a bad thing, but it's almost kind of different from what you saw where you saw.
The warm light group was more depolymerized the red light therapy group, which is like a that's a totally different, like kind of treatment because they're getting like a dose of like just red light, where the phone is probably emitting a broader spectrum at a different kind of, you know, intensity. So we had a number of groups test light based questions, which is very interesting.
And yeah, there's a lot of very topical, light based things that are really prevalent right now in society, whether it's because of technology and it's because of research like this that has led to questions like new, really weird, innovative ways to approach things like cosmetics. Yeah, you guys came up with really interesting questions. And so, yeah, it's actually made me kind of really think about things in my own life because I have my phone like three inches from my face a lot.
Gus Peters
Yeah, I went to the eye doctor right before the results of this experiment. We got them and they were asking me their if I wanted blue light filters put on my lenses, and after this I'm like, I don't know if I want that anymore.
Evan Schultz
Interesting. Yeah. So they actually make interesting,
Maria Losito
Yeah. It's fascinating to know. And now I'm like thinking so much more I'm aware about. All right. And then in regards to the experiment, is there anything that we did not talk about that you think we should touch on?
Maria Losito
what did you enjoy most about the experiment in, like, working in the lab?
Gus Peters
I learned a lot of cool lab techniques. I've not gotten to do many of the things that we've done in this class before. So we got to, like, count cells. We got to stain them. We had experience culturing stuff using all the centrifuges. It just felt honestly very professional. It felt like I was working in like a really focused lab.
And I have not had that experience before KU mostly because I haven't taken other biology lab courses. I'm sure they're all great, but this one was very fun.
Maria Losito
Yeah, I mean, I'm glad that you had an opportunity to get a really hands on experience because I'm sure it it changed kind of how you're viewing these college courses and possibly even what you're planning like to get on to and do later in life.
Gus Peters
Yeah, it was it was also nice just being able to design, like your own experiment to just take those skills that you learn and then really look at something that you want to look at, like it made the class feel like it built somewhere. And I really enjoyed that.
Maria Losito
How do you think all the experiments you did over the course of the semester are going to benefit you in the future?
Gus Peters
Yeah, I'm taking more Lab classes at KU. Hopefully this will be a lot better for me. Now that I know how to run more experiments. I'll be working at KU over the summer in a lab and hopefully this will show me how to stain and stuff if I ever want to test those sorts of questions.
Evan Schultz
Yeah, I think you're really prepared to work in a lab and to progress with your research here because you're you're standing was beautiful. You're, you know, not just your immunocytochemistry, but also your Western blot work and your cell culture work was all fantastic. And you I think you've really grown a lot as a scientist. And like you're saying, I think you became really pretty professional over the course of semester at what you're doing. So that was really that was really fulfilling for me to see.
Maria Losito
What about the lab did you enjoy most?
Gus Peters
I enjoyed just spending time in there. I've been in a lot of Chem labs as opposed to biology labs, and I think Chem labs feel like a grind, which is maybe just because I've always taken them at 2 p.m. and gotten out at six when it's dark out. But I liked just being in this lab because it very much felt like the time that was passing was still productive.
And like, waiting on experiments actually meant something. Instead of sitting in Chem lab waiting for something to heat up for an hour and a half, which is not a slight against chem live. I'm taking two chem labs next semester, but I just like this different experience of being able to run lab work.
Evan Shultz
Thank you for you were a really fun part of class, and actually, you were a really deep thinker.
You thought very deeply about the questions you asked with your independent experiment, and you were also a really creative thinker. So that's something I really enjoyed having about you in class.
Gus Peters
Thank you. Yeah, you were a really good TA I enjoyed, I enjoyed the class. I was a little horrified looking at your cell staining when it had like 15 colors on it. And I was watching what it takes to make like 2 or 3, but it was. Yeah, it was a really fun class.
Maria Losito
Thank you so much for joining us today. Really appreciate you taking the time.
Evan Shultz
Yeah. Thank you.
Maria Losito
We're now joined by Toby Brown. Would you mind telling us a little bit about yourself?
Toby Brown
Yeah, sure. So I'm a molecular, cellular and developmental biology major with a minor in sociology here at the University of Kansas. And I'm involved in medical and public health research. And as a nontraditional student, I'm also actively engaged in parenting.
Maria Losito
As a non trad student, do you have any advice that you would like to give people on sort of that track?
Toby Brown
Absolutely. I'm glad you asked. Thank you for giving the opportunity. Yeah. I would highly encourage all nontraditional students to know that you are at the right spot. You are able to access the resources and the knowledge you need to meet the goals that you have here at the University of Kansas. So never feel like you are incapable of pursuing those goals.
Maybe a little more may require a little, little more, you know, strategy, but you can do it. Trust me, you can do it.
Maria Losito
And then, if I remember right, I believe you're graduating this year. Congratulations. That's amazing news.
Toby Brown
Thank you so much. I'm so excited.
Maria Losito
So what is kind of what's your what are your thoughts for the next step?
Toby Brown
So my next step is I've just earned entrance into completing an internship with the thesis program. So I'll be doing some indigenous research in Oklahoma over the summer.
Maria Losito
That's amazing. I’m really excited! Congrats.
Would you mind telling us about your research project and why you picked that particular treatment?
Toby Brown
Yeah, absolutely. My lab partner and I researched how different electrolyte concentrations affect HeLa cells by treating them with varying dilutions of a commercial electrolyte solution, and this allowed us to simulate acute changes in electrolyte conditions. So we chose this treatment to try to better understand how electrolyte solutions influence cell structure beyond just their typical role in human hydration.
Maria Losito
What did you end up seeing?
Toby Brown
Well, we found that both low and high electrolyte concentrations altered cell growth and morphology compared to like our control group.
So we tested this using GFP and Dapi fluorescence microscopy and staining to observe the actin cytoskeleton in cell nuclei, which permitted us to clearly detect structural differences.
Maria Losito
Yeah. So I'm a bit of a visual learner. So like can you describe like what those structural differences were for us.
Toby Brown
Absolutely. So thankfully because we had guidance from our GTA Evan and of course Doctor Hueston, we were able to know that sometimes when you're looking at the morphology of a cell, you will notice that sometimes the outer boundaries, specifically the cytoskeleton, will be stretched or maybe shrunken or maybe expanded. So usually a cell is pretty-- They all have kind of like a pretty much variable similarity in their structure.
But when we were exposing these to a extracellular concentration of electrolytes, we noticed that there was shrinking in these particular cells, which was right along the lines of what we had predicted. So it was really cool to be able to see that, in fact, that these concentrations of electrolytes did, in fact shrink the cell, which was right along the lines with our prediction.
Maria Losito
Why were you expecting to see cell shrinkage?
Toby Brown
Yeah. Thanks for asking. So we initially, to be really honest,
we were predicting that actually there would be expansion. So we actually had thought, oh, there's going to be this growth. And clearly when we started thinking about things about like, you know, when you add salt to something, it typically is going to shrink. We started realizing, oh, maybe we ought to realign our thoughts here.
So, so from the layman perspective, which I can identify very easily, usually we did have to kind of analyze and do some critical thinking about the concepts involved with this shrinking the idea of Hypertonicity, which is like the shrinking and expanding of cells based on the concentration of solutes. So the idea was just that we were trying to think about the fact that typically we all hydrate with electrolytes, but what are they doing on a on a molecular and cellular basis. So that's kind of kind of what we're looking to do here.
Evan Shultz
And that's a really interesting point. I thought it was so cool. How you guys picked your project. I actually really liked it because we're not allowed to name brands here because we want to avoid like, a lawsuit. And I don't know if this brand has like a catchphrase that.
Electrolytes often, you know, whether they're blue or they're yellow, that's typically the kind of flavorings that they're called. It's very popular that we drink it all the time. Actually, yours, the product that you used was colorless, wasn't it?
Toby Brown
That's right. Evan, thankfully, you and Dr. Hueston had to try to encourage my partner and I to use critical analysis with, with, you know, thought for also the potential confounding variables that we wanted to try to create some do some research that didn't have alternative reasons that the cells could be changing with regard to their morphology and structure.
So thankfully, because of your guidance, we were able to find an electrolyte, a commercial electrolyte solution that was in fact colorless and had no additives. So it was simply electrolyte water. So it was ideally something you'd want to use with regard to like an experiment, because there was less opportunity for those confounding variables to be what's impacting what we saw in our results.
Evan Shultz
And I was actually really, really blown away by results. You did see, I kind of thought, I don't know why I thought this, but I kind of thought like, maybe because your exposure wasn't like super long. And I was kind of thinking that because we drink a lot of this, that it wouldn't be that disruptive. But it was.
The state of Florida is not going to be happy about this. But yeah, it was it was it was so interesting. I mean, I'm not necessarily thinking doing that to our bodies, but like even just to see how the change in electrolyte concentration affect the cells was really interesting.
Toby Brown
And Evan, that's exactly what made this so cool, was that we all know that we need electrolytes when we're working out, we're sweating, we're losing our solutes in the form of sweat. But when we're looking at this from that molecular and cellular level, it's like, oh, this is what happens. But how does hydration work if we need electrolytes?
So it was really cool to see it, see it at the molecular and cellular level. Like you said, it's really cool.
Maria Losito
In a way. I sort of feel like it just reiterates how important keeping paying attention to serving size is, because I know I've had some of like the powder stuff when I was sweating a ton doing extreme hiking, and there's very much you do not want to go over the limit for today. So yeah.
Toby Brown
Maria, you know, with that very what you just said, that's exactly what the future plans are with this research. There's research right now that's looking at trying to personalize the medicine and the use of electrolytes based on the person's, you know, variable characteristics like height, weight, because they're saying that just like you said, that there is the need to consider that, for example, I'm a different weight and body mass compared to you and Evan.
So my need for electrolyte amount is more than likely going to be variable with, you know, in comparison to what you may need. So yes, these are all future direct directions and directives that are being actively researched as we as we do this podcast.
Evan Shultz
Yeah, I think it's a good point because the classic phrase the dose makes the poison, the dose also makes the medicine. So that's a really that's a really interesting point that you bring up.
Maria Losito
Indeed. And honestly glad to know that they're like making it more specific to people, because I think within the last few years it came out, or at least I became aware that, like, they didn't start testing drugs on females until I think it was the year I was born, 1993. And so like just sort of think about that.
It's only been 30 years of having everyone being tested. So like hearing about sort of micro testing is yeah, that's thrilling.
Evan Shultz
Yeah. That is a really important expansion that's going on in the field of biomedical science. And I appreciate it. Sounds like you're also going to be kind of doing that with your own career. Is looking at subclassifying how different things affect different groups of people? I think that's really, really important. Just to like your point, Maria, about it not being tested in women.
I think this is a complicated issue, but one group of people that isn't tested very often for drugs is pregnant people. And there's obviously reasons why people would be afraid to test that. But it also means that we just don't know. So there's all kinds of and there's beyond just, you know, biological sex and all that kind of stuff.
There are so many groups of people that are just underrepresented in these, in these studies. And I'm really excited for you, Toby, to in your career. I hope that's something that you can always keep with you and a focus that you can keep with your work.
Toby Brown
Yeah. Thank you. Evan, I appreciate your comment, and I do. I definitely agree with you that the need to, you know, have greater data on less represented populations so that we can, you know, make better opportunities for personalized medicine and other, you know, biomedical related needs regarding people in their health.
Maria Losito
Yeah. Super important. So I'm just glad that we're seeing a change in, you know, things will get better. Right? It's what we hope. What did you enjoy most about your experiment?
Toby Brown
You know, I, as Evan had shared earlier, I found it most exciting to be designing this independent freestyle experiment and to be able to then actually make visual these results, how it all came together. It made me feel like an actual practicing scientist, and I cannot say that I've ever felt like that and my confidence has increased because I was able to get that hands on experience and put forth action toward things I had been reading about for the last four years.
I got to actually participate in them and so it's really, really amazing to be able to say that I now have the confidence now feeling more like a scientist these days.
Maria Losito
How do you think all of the projects and experiments that you did in this class and the lab, how do you think that's going to benefit you moving forward?
Toby Brown
This experience helped me build a central lab skills and strengthen my critical thinking and
data analysis abilities, which will definitely be valuable in my future regarding biomedical science and medicine.
Evan Shultz
Yeah. I just want to say, you actually, like. It was really amazing. You guys got amazing results. You're you're you're immunocytochemistry was beautiful. Your Western blotting was beautiful. You guys also did a great job in the cell culture hood. Like you guys did a great job all semester. You grew immensely. And I would say, like you and all of your classmates were all incredibly qualified to do these things in the real world for real scientists, as real scientists, because that's what you guys did.
You guys did real science. You tested a real scientific question by real scientific means. And yeah, it was you. It's been a joy to have you in the course. You're. I'm really glad that you asked such an interesting question, because I think that is a really what it's all about. And I think that kind of to what you were saying, Maria, figuring out if you really enjoy something is critical for all the students out there.
Really just make sure that you're doing something because it's something that you enjoy doing and that you can see yourself getting excited about going to work every day, because you'll have to go to work every day.
Maria Losito
Yeah, enjoying your job makes the daily grind so much better. And like, you know, KU's been great to me, but like, the job I had before wasn't. And so it's just like A: remember, you're never stuck where you are. It can always get better. You can always change what you're doing. But like, it helps knowing what you like.
Evan Shultz
That's right. Yeah. And I also want to say there is no linear path. I think a lot of students have this idea that there's like this way that you're supposed to progress. And I can tell you that wasn't the case for me. That's not the case for really anyone, I don't think. And it does not matter so much as you're doing what you feel fulfilled doing and that you're making progress towards your goal.
So if things change, don't get discouraged. Keep an open mind. And then also taking courses like this really do help you figure out what you enjoy physically doing because you'll actually physically do these things, not just read about them in the textbook. You will physically do them. And I've had students in this course think that they wanted to go in a particular career direction, and they actually fell in love with doing research, and they from there joined a lab and actually are pursuing more of a research oriented career.
So getting that hands on experience with whatever it is I think is critical.
Maria Losito
Yeah, honestly great advice. What part of the lab did you enjoy most?
Toby Brown
I really enjoyed working alongside my colleagues. They're incredible and bright, and they provided both academic and insight, and they provided a sense of community toward me. So that made my experience even more rewarding.
Evan Shultz
Yeah, Toby, you elevated the class. So, like, you're you are a people person. You are fantastic with the people. And there are days that I came in and I was kind of having a crappy day, and you made my day better and you made it because very much people, you know, science is a people thing. It's very much based off of a our own cultures and even just the vibes we're putting out.
Evan Shultz
So if I'm not putting out good vibes, the class isn't going to have a good as good of a time. It's not going to go as well. And there's been a number of times that you actually made the classical better because you brought your own, you know, interpersonal skills into how you interacted, not just with your students, but with me.
And that was just so much fun. You were a blast to have in class. Yeah.
Toby Brown
Thank you. Evan. And you know, that all goes back to exactly what you said about this not being a linear path, because my path is not linear. I think that helps me to be so thankful for being in the position I am right now. Like taking cell biology lab, that that was something that I am so incredibly thankful that I got to participate in as a as a student.
Evan Shultz
Oh, I'm glad to hear that, because I was actually very inspired by you when I learned about your path. And the work you put in is amazing. You put in so much work and you have to go. So like when it sometimes, you know, nonlinear paths are just fine, but sometimes they do mean that you have so much more to think about and so much more to do. And that's just been really, really inspirational for me. Your ability to do that is amazing.
Toby Brown
Thanks, Evan.
Maria Losito
Toby, thank you so much for joining us today. It was amazing to hear about your research about like where you plan to go in life. And yeah, it's just been great talking with you.
Toby Brown
Thank you. Maria, I'm so glad I got to finally meet the GOAT in person.
Maria Losito
Thank you.
I want to thank all of our student researchers for joining me today. I hope hearing about their research inspired you to learn more about everything we talked about.
Thank you again for listening to Interview with a Biologist. If you'd like to learn more about KU biology degrees or the classes offered here, please check out biology.ku.edu.